Find the coordinate of two line segments that are perpendicular
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How can the x,y position (actually will need in 3d but for simplicity asking in 2d) of a point be found if it is the intersection of two perpendicular line segments.
I have two points, $p_1$ and $p_2$ that are known $x,y$ locations. I also have line segments with known lengths $a$ and $b$. I made a diagram below to illustrate the problem.
geometry trigonometry
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
How can the x,y position (actually will need in 3d but for simplicity asking in 2d) of a point be found if it is the intersection of two perpendicular line segments.
I have two points, $p_1$ and $p_2$ that are known $x,y$ locations. I also have line segments with known lengths $a$ and $b$. I made a diagram below to illustrate the problem.
geometry trigonometry
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
If the lengths $a$ and $b$ are fixed, then you must also have $lVert p_1-p_2rVert^2=a^2+b^2$ for there to be any solution at all. It this condition is meth, then there can be up to four solutions, two if $p_1$ must be an endpoint of $a$ and $p_2$ must be an endpoint of $b$.
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– amd
1 hour ago
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@amd yes p1 and p2 are the endpoints of a and b. I need their mutual endpoint
$endgroup$
– user1938107
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
How can the x,y position (actually will need in 3d but for simplicity asking in 2d) of a point be found if it is the intersection of two perpendicular line segments.
I have two points, $p_1$ and $p_2$ that are known $x,y$ locations. I also have line segments with known lengths $a$ and $b$. I made a diagram below to illustrate the problem.
geometry trigonometry
$endgroup$
How can the x,y position (actually will need in 3d but for simplicity asking in 2d) of a point be found if it is the intersection of two perpendicular line segments.
I have two points, $p_1$ and $p_2$ that are known $x,y$ locations. I also have line segments with known lengths $a$ and $b$. I made a diagram below to illustrate the problem.
geometry trigonometry
geometry trigonometry
asked 2 hours ago
user1938107user1938107
15310
15310
$begingroup$
If the lengths $a$ and $b$ are fixed, then you must also have $lVert p_1-p_2rVert^2=a^2+b^2$ for there to be any solution at all. It this condition is meth, then there can be up to four solutions, two if $p_1$ must be an endpoint of $a$ and $p_2$ must be an endpoint of $b$.
$endgroup$
– amd
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@amd yes p1 and p2 are the endpoints of a and b. I need their mutual endpoint
$endgroup$
– user1938107
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If the lengths $a$ and $b$ are fixed, then you must also have $lVert p_1-p_2rVert^2=a^2+b^2$ for there to be any solution at all. It this condition is meth, then there can be up to four solutions, two if $p_1$ must be an endpoint of $a$ and $p_2$ must be an endpoint of $b$.
$endgroup$
– amd
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@amd yes p1 and p2 are the endpoints of a and b. I need their mutual endpoint
$endgroup$
– user1938107
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
If the lengths $a$ and $b$ are fixed, then you must also have $lVert p_1-p_2rVert^2=a^2+b^2$ for there to be any solution at all. It this condition is meth, then there can be up to four solutions, two if $p_1$ must be an endpoint of $a$ and $p_2$ must be an endpoint of $b$.
$endgroup$
– amd
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
If the lengths $a$ and $b$ are fixed, then you must also have $lVert p_1-p_2rVert^2=a^2+b^2$ for there to be any solution at all. It this condition is meth, then there can be up to four solutions, two if $p_1$ must be an endpoint of $a$ and $p_2$ must be an endpoint of $b$.
$endgroup$
– amd
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@amd yes p1 and p2 are the endpoints of a and b. I need their mutual endpoint
$endgroup$
– user1938107
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@amd yes p1 and p2 are the endpoints of a and b. I need their mutual endpoint
$endgroup$
– user1938107
1 hour ago
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Sometimes a figure is worth a 1000 words:
In three dimensions:
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If you draw a circle with diameter $sqrt{a^2+b^2}$ then $p_3$ can be either of two points on that circle.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $ell$ be the distance between $p_1$ and $p_2$, and let $p_3$ be the point where the two line segments will meet.
The three points $p_1, p_2, p_3$ form a triangle whose side lengths we know: $a, b, ell$.
We can find out where $p_3$ is by measuring properties of this triangle. Draw a perpendicular altitude from $p_3$ down to the side of the triangle between $p_1$ and $p_2$. Call the intersection point $p_4$.
If we knew the length $h$ of this altitude, we would know where to put $p_3$. First, we could find out where $p_4$ is. By the Pythagorean theorem, the distance between $p_1$ and $p_4$ is $sqrt{a^2 - h^2}$. So
$$p_4 = p_1 + frac{sqrt{a^2-h^2}}{ell} (p_2 - p_1)$$
Next, we would use $p_4$ to find out where to put $p_3$. We start from $p_4$ and travel a distance $h$ in a direction perpendicular to the $p_1$ $p_2$ base of the triangle.
In two dimensions, we have two choices of perpendicular direction. In three dimensions, we actually have an infinite number of perpendicular directions[*], so you'll have to pick one. Pick a unit vector $widehat{u}$ in a perpendicular direction.
Then $p_3 = p_4 + hcdot widehat{u}$, which gives you the answer you want.
But how do we find $h$? We can find $h$ if we know the area of the triangle. Heron's formula lets you calculate the area of the triangle when you know the length of all the sides. $A = sqrt{s(s-a)(s-b)(s-ell)}$, where $s$ is half the perimeter $s = (a+b+ell)/2$. Once you have the area, you can calculate the height of the altitude: $A = frac{1}{2}text{base}timestext{height}$, so $h = 2A/ell$.
[*] In 3D, you have an infinite number of perpendicular directions. Imagine $p_1=langle 0,0rangle$ and $p_2 = langle 1,0rangle$, and $a$ and $b$ are some numbers. There's a satisfactory point $p_3$ in the x-y plane. But if you spin $p_3$ around the $x$-axis, you find an infinite number of other satisfactory points too.
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add a comment |
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3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Sometimes a figure is worth a 1000 words:
In three dimensions:
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Sometimes a figure is worth a 1000 words:
In three dimensions:
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Sometimes a figure is worth a 1000 words:
In three dimensions:
$endgroup$
Sometimes a figure is worth a 1000 words:
In three dimensions:
edited 27 mins ago
answered 1 hour ago
David G. StorkDavid G. Stork
12.3k41836
12.3k41836
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If you draw a circle with diameter $sqrt{a^2+b^2}$ then $p_3$ can be either of two points on that circle.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If you draw a circle with diameter $sqrt{a^2+b^2}$ then $p_3$ can be either of two points on that circle.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If you draw a circle with diameter $sqrt{a^2+b^2}$ then $p_3$ can be either of two points on that circle.
$endgroup$
If you draw a circle with diameter $sqrt{a^2+b^2}$ then $p_3$ can be either of two points on that circle.
edited 2 hours ago
answered 2 hours ago
steven gregorysteven gregory
18.5k32459
18.5k32459
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
The lengths $a$ and $b$ are also fixed so this doesn't completely work.
$endgroup$
– AHusain
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Sorry, this answer should have been a comment.
$endgroup$
– steven gregory
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
sure, but how can I find where that point is on the circle?
$endgroup$
– user1938107
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $ell$ be the distance between $p_1$ and $p_2$, and let $p_3$ be the point where the two line segments will meet.
The three points $p_1, p_2, p_3$ form a triangle whose side lengths we know: $a, b, ell$.
We can find out where $p_3$ is by measuring properties of this triangle. Draw a perpendicular altitude from $p_3$ down to the side of the triangle between $p_1$ and $p_2$. Call the intersection point $p_4$.
If we knew the length $h$ of this altitude, we would know where to put $p_3$. First, we could find out where $p_4$ is. By the Pythagorean theorem, the distance between $p_1$ and $p_4$ is $sqrt{a^2 - h^2}$. So
$$p_4 = p_1 + frac{sqrt{a^2-h^2}}{ell} (p_2 - p_1)$$
Next, we would use $p_4$ to find out where to put $p_3$. We start from $p_4$ and travel a distance $h$ in a direction perpendicular to the $p_1$ $p_2$ base of the triangle.
In two dimensions, we have two choices of perpendicular direction. In three dimensions, we actually have an infinite number of perpendicular directions[*], so you'll have to pick one. Pick a unit vector $widehat{u}$ in a perpendicular direction.
Then $p_3 = p_4 + hcdot widehat{u}$, which gives you the answer you want.
But how do we find $h$? We can find $h$ if we know the area of the triangle. Heron's formula lets you calculate the area of the triangle when you know the length of all the sides. $A = sqrt{s(s-a)(s-b)(s-ell)}$, where $s$ is half the perimeter $s = (a+b+ell)/2$. Once you have the area, you can calculate the height of the altitude: $A = frac{1}{2}text{base}timestext{height}$, so $h = 2A/ell$.
[*] In 3D, you have an infinite number of perpendicular directions. Imagine $p_1=langle 0,0rangle$ and $p_2 = langle 1,0rangle$, and $a$ and $b$ are some numbers. There's a satisfactory point $p_3$ in the x-y plane. But if you spin $p_3$ around the $x$-axis, you find an infinite number of other satisfactory points too.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $ell$ be the distance between $p_1$ and $p_2$, and let $p_3$ be the point where the two line segments will meet.
The three points $p_1, p_2, p_3$ form a triangle whose side lengths we know: $a, b, ell$.
We can find out where $p_3$ is by measuring properties of this triangle. Draw a perpendicular altitude from $p_3$ down to the side of the triangle between $p_1$ and $p_2$. Call the intersection point $p_4$.
If we knew the length $h$ of this altitude, we would know where to put $p_3$. First, we could find out where $p_4$ is. By the Pythagorean theorem, the distance between $p_1$ and $p_4$ is $sqrt{a^2 - h^2}$. So
$$p_4 = p_1 + frac{sqrt{a^2-h^2}}{ell} (p_2 - p_1)$$
Next, we would use $p_4$ to find out where to put $p_3$. We start from $p_4$ and travel a distance $h$ in a direction perpendicular to the $p_1$ $p_2$ base of the triangle.
In two dimensions, we have two choices of perpendicular direction. In three dimensions, we actually have an infinite number of perpendicular directions[*], so you'll have to pick one. Pick a unit vector $widehat{u}$ in a perpendicular direction.
Then $p_3 = p_4 + hcdot widehat{u}$, which gives you the answer you want.
But how do we find $h$? We can find $h$ if we know the area of the triangle. Heron's formula lets you calculate the area of the triangle when you know the length of all the sides. $A = sqrt{s(s-a)(s-b)(s-ell)}$, where $s$ is half the perimeter $s = (a+b+ell)/2$. Once you have the area, you can calculate the height of the altitude: $A = frac{1}{2}text{base}timestext{height}$, so $h = 2A/ell$.
[*] In 3D, you have an infinite number of perpendicular directions. Imagine $p_1=langle 0,0rangle$ and $p_2 = langle 1,0rangle$, and $a$ and $b$ are some numbers. There's a satisfactory point $p_3$ in the x-y plane. But if you spin $p_3$ around the $x$-axis, you find an infinite number of other satisfactory points too.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $ell$ be the distance between $p_1$ and $p_2$, and let $p_3$ be the point where the two line segments will meet.
The three points $p_1, p_2, p_3$ form a triangle whose side lengths we know: $a, b, ell$.
We can find out where $p_3$ is by measuring properties of this triangle. Draw a perpendicular altitude from $p_3$ down to the side of the triangle between $p_1$ and $p_2$. Call the intersection point $p_4$.
If we knew the length $h$ of this altitude, we would know where to put $p_3$. First, we could find out where $p_4$ is. By the Pythagorean theorem, the distance between $p_1$ and $p_4$ is $sqrt{a^2 - h^2}$. So
$$p_4 = p_1 + frac{sqrt{a^2-h^2}}{ell} (p_2 - p_1)$$
Next, we would use $p_4$ to find out where to put $p_3$. We start from $p_4$ and travel a distance $h$ in a direction perpendicular to the $p_1$ $p_2$ base of the triangle.
In two dimensions, we have two choices of perpendicular direction. In three dimensions, we actually have an infinite number of perpendicular directions[*], so you'll have to pick one. Pick a unit vector $widehat{u}$ in a perpendicular direction.
Then $p_3 = p_4 + hcdot widehat{u}$, which gives you the answer you want.
But how do we find $h$? We can find $h$ if we know the area of the triangle. Heron's formula lets you calculate the area of the triangle when you know the length of all the sides. $A = sqrt{s(s-a)(s-b)(s-ell)}$, where $s$ is half the perimeter $s = (a+b+ell)/2$. Once you have the area, you can calculate the height of the altitude: $A = frac{1}{2}text{base}timestext{height}$, so $h = 2A/ell$.
[*] In 3D, you have an infinite number of perpendicular directions. Imagine $p_1=langle 0,0rangle$ and $p_2 = langle 1,0rangle$, and $a$ and $b$ are some numbers. There's a satisfactory point $p_3$ in the x-y plane. But if you spin $p_3$ around the $x$-axis, you find an infinite number of other satisfactory points too.
$endgroup$
Let $ell$ be the distance between $p_1$ and $p_2$, and let $p_3$ be the point where the two line segments will meet.
The three points $p_1, p_2, p_3$ form a triangle whose side lengths we know: $a, b, ell$.
We can find out where $p_3$ is by measuring properties of this triangle. Draw a perpendicular altitude from $p_3$ down to the side of the triangle between $p_1$ and $p_2$. Call the intersection point $p_4$.
If we knew the length $h$ of this altitude, we would know where to put $p_3$. First, we could find out where $p_4$ is. By the Pythagorean theorem, the distance between $p_1$ and $p_4$ is $sqrt{a^2 - h^2}$. So
$$p_4 = p_1 + frac{sqrt{a^2-h^2}}{ell} (p_2 - p_1)$$
Next, we would use $p_4$ to find out where to put $p_3$. We start from $p_4$ and travel a distance $h$ in a direction perpendicular to the $p_1$ $p_2$ base of the triangle.
In two dimensions, we have two choices of perpendicular direction. In three dimensions, we actually have an infinite number of perpendicular directions[*], so you'll have to pick one. Pick a unit vector $widehat{u}$ in a perpendicular direction.
Then $p_3 = p_4 + hcdot widehat{u}$, which gives you the answer you want.
But how do we find $h$? We can find $h$ if we know the area of the triangle. Heron's formula lets you calculate the area of the triangle when you know the length of all the sides. $A = sqrt{s(s-a)(s-b)(s-ell)}$, where $s$ is half the perimeter $s = (a+b+ell)/2$. Once you have the area, you can calculate the height of the altitude: $A = frac{1}{2}text{base}timestext{height}$, so $h = 2A/ell$.
[*] In 3D, you have an infinite number of perpendicular directions. Imagine $p_1=langle 0,0rangle$ and $p_2 = langle 1,0rangle$, and $a$ and $b$ are some numbers. There's a satisfactory point $p_3$ in the x-y plane. But if you spin $p_3$ around the $x$-axis, you find an infinite number of other satisfactory points too.
answered 1 hour ago
user326210user326210
9,462927
9,462927
add a comment |
add a comment |
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$begingroup$
If the lengths $a$ and $b$ are fixed, then you must also have $lVert p_1-p_2rVert^2=a^2+b^2$ for there to be any solution at all. It this condition is meth, then there can be up to four solutions, two if $p_1$ must be an endpoint of $a$ and $p_2$ must be an endpoint of $b$.
$endgroup$
– amd
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@amd yes p1 and p2 are the endpoints of a and b. I need their mutual endpoint
$endgroup$
– user1938107
1 hour ago