Does a creature that is immune to a condition still make a saving throw?
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Let's say a 5th level Lore Bard casts fear on a violet fungus not knowing that that it is immune to the frightened condition.
Does the violet fungus still make a saving throw? In particular, is a saving throw rolled which the Bard can use (and admittedly waste) its Cutting Words on? (A divination Wizard's Portent feature could also be used on, and be wasted by, such a saving throw.)
dnd-5e saving-throw conditions immunities
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
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add a comment |
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Let's say a 5th level Lore Bard casts fear on a violet fungus not knowing that that it is immune to the frightened condition.
Does the violet fungus still make a saving throw? In particular, is a saving throw rolled which the Bard can use (and admittedly waste) its Cutting Words on? (A divination Wizard's Portent feature could also be used on, and be wasted by, such a saving throw.)
dnd-5e saving-throw conditions immunities
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let's say a 5th level Lore Bard casts fear on a violet fungus not knowing that that it is immune to the frightened condition.
Does the violet fungus still make a saving throw? In particular, is a saving throw rolled which the Bard can use (and admittedly waste) its Cutting Words on? (A divination Wizard's Portent feature could also be used on, and be wasted by, such a saving throw.)
dnd-5e saving-throw conditions immunities
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
$endgroup$
Let's say a 5th level Lore Bard casts fear on a violet fungus not knowing that that it is immune to the frightened condition.
Does the violet fungus still make a saving throw? In particular, is a saving throw rolled which the Bard can use (and admittedly waste) its Cutting Words on? (A divination Wizard's Portent feature could also be used on, and be wasted by, such a saving throw.)
dnd-5e saving-throw conditions immunities
dnd-5e saving-throw conditions immunities
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
edited 33 mins ago
V2Blast
28.1k5101171
28.1k5101171
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
asked 1 hour ago
Someone_EvilSomeone_Evil
3,8891036
3,8891036
add a comment |
add a comment |
2 Answers
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Immunity to a condition would just mean that if this condition were to affect it, it would do nothing instead.
Each creature in a 30-foot cone must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or drop whatever it is holding and become frightened for the duration.
The target still makes a saving throw as called for, but regardless of whether it fails or passes, it cannot be frightened. Any changes made by a portent or Cutting Words would be wasted if the characters were unaware of the immunity.
Another example would be a Wizard casting Sunburst on an Ochre Jelly
On a failed save, a creature takes 12d6 radiant damage and is blinded for 1 minute.
An Ochre Jelly is immune to the Blinded condition, but a saving throw is still called for.
Undead and oozes have disadvantage on this saving throw.
The Ochre Jelly is even making the saving throw with disadvantage, but is still unable to be affected by the blinding effect of the spell.
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
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You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
No
The violet fungus would not make a saving throw.
In the PHB under Saving Throw it says:
A saving throw — also called a save — represents an attempt to resist a spell, a trap, a poison, a disease, or a similar threat. You don’t normally decide to make a saving throw; you are forced to make one because your character or monster is at risk of harm.
The violet fungus cited as an example would not make a saving throw. It is not resisting the fear spell, it is just incapable of being affected by it.
It is not "at risk of harm" from the fear spell, so it is not forced to make a save.
Similarly, a creature without vision would not save against being blinded, a creature incapable of being hurt by fire would not save against fire damage.
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
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$begingroup$
Immunity to a condition would just mean that if this condition were to affect it, it would do nothing instead.
Each creature in a 30-foot cone must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or drop whatever it is holding and become frightened for the duration.
The target still makes a saving throw as called for, but regardless of whether it fails or passes, it cannot be frightened. Any changes made by a portent or Cutting Words would be wasted if the characters were unaware of the immunity.
Another example would be a Wizard casting Sunburst on an Ochre Jelly
On a failed save, a creature takes 12d6 radiant damage and is blinded for 1 minute.
An Ochre Jelly is immune to the Blinded condition, but a saving throw is still called for.
Undead and oozes have disadvantage on this saving throw.
The Ochre Jelly is even making the saving throw with disadvantage, but is still unable to be affected by the blinding effect of the spell.
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
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Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Immunity to a condition would just mean that if this condition were to affect it, it would do nothing instead.
Each creature in a 30-foot cone must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or drop whatever it is holding and become frightened for the duration.
The target still makes a saving throw as called for, but regardless of whether it fails or passes, it cannot be frightened. Any changes made by a portent or Cutting Words would be wasted if the characters were unaware of the immunity.
Another example would be a Wizard casting Sunburst on an Ochre Jelly
On a failed save, a creature takes 12d6 radiant damage and is blinded for 1 minute.
An Ochre Jelly is immune to the Blinded condition, but a saving throw is still called for.
Undead and oozes have disadvantage on this saving throw.
The Ochre Jelly is even making the saving throw with disadvantage, but is still unable to be affected by the blinding effect of the spell.
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
New contributor
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
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$begingroup$
You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Immunity to a condition would just mean that if this condition were to affect it, it would do nothing instead.
Each creature in a 30-foot cone must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or drop whatever it is holding and become frightened for the duration.
The target still makes a saving throw as called for, but regardless of whether it fails or passes, it cannot be frightened. Any changes made by a portent or Cutting Words would be wasted if the characters were unaware of the immunity.
Another example would be a Wizard casting Sunburst on an Ochre Jelly
On a failed save, a creature takes 12d6 radiant damage and is blinded for 1 minute.
An Ochre Jelly is immune to the Blinded condition, but a saving throw is still called for.
Undead and oozes have disadvantage on this saving throw.
The Ochre Jelly is even making the saving throw with disadvantage, but is still unable to be affected by the blinding effect of the spell.
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
New contributor
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
Immunity to a condition would just mean that if this condition were to affect it, it would do nothing instead.
Each creature in a 30-foot cone must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or drop whatever it is holding and become frightened for the duration.
The target still makes a saving throw as called for, but regardless of whether it fails or passes, it cannot be frightened. Any changes made by a portent or Cutting Words would be wasted if the characters were unaware of the immunity.
Another example would be a Wizard casting Sunburst on an Ochre Jelly
On a failed save, a creature takes 12d6 radiant damage and is blinded for 1 minute.
An Ochre Jelly is immune to the Blinded condition, but a saving throw is still called for.
Undead and oozes have disadvantage on this saving throw.
The Ochre Jelly is even making the saving throw with disadvantage, but is still unable to be affected by the blinding effect of the spell.
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
New contributor
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 20 mins ago
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
New contributor
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
answered 50 mins ago
SeidrSeidr
233111
233111
New contributor
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Seidr is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$begingroup$
You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
$begingroup$
You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
You answer would be improved by citing a source. Someone else could easily logically say the target doesn't make the save, being immune. For instance, why would a creature incapable of sight save against light, or a creature without the ability to perceive sound save against it? I can find no rules to support either position. If you can make a rules-based argument, that's one thing; otherwise, it seems to me the rules don't specify.
$endgroup$
– Jack
42 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Jack It is never said anywhere that each creature must make/succeed on a saving throw unless they are immune to the condition that this spell imposes. The spell specifically calls for a saving throw to be made. The spell is only inflicting the condition, the condition is not asking for a saving throw.
$endgroup$
– Seidr
39 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
It might also be worth citing examples of spells, monster abilities, or other effects where the condition is only one of multiple effects (e.g. damage) that are imposed on a failed save. Sometimes a creature might not take damage from a failed save due to immunity to that damage type but might be affected by a certain condition on a failed save - or vice versa.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
31 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr If your argument is that the general rule is that the spell requires a save and there's no specific rule over-riding it, then you might consider putting that in your argument.
$endgroup$
– Jack
22 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
$begingroup$
@Seidr I don't think Sunburst is the best example, since (at least as I read it) the jelly still takes radiant damage independent of being blinded, and the saving throw reduces the damage as well as resisting the blind
$endgroup$
– Saladani
15 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
No
The violet fungus would not make a saving throw.
In the PHB under Saving Throw it says:
A saving throw — also called a save — represents an attempt to resist a spell, a trap, a poison, a disease, or a similar threat. You don’t normally decide to make a saving throw; you are forced to make one because your character or monster is at risk of harm.
The violet fungus cited as an example would not make a saving throw. It is not resisting the fear spell, it is just incapable of being affected by it.
It is not "at risk of harm" from the fear spell, so it is not forced to make a save.
Similarly, a creature without vision would not save against being blinded, a creature incapable of being hurt by fire would not save against fire damage.
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
No
The violet fungus would not make a saving throw.
In the PHB under Saving Throw it says:
A saving throw — also called a save — represents an attempt to resist a spell, a trap, a poison, a disease, or a similar threat. You don’t normally decide to make a saving throw; you are forced to make one because your character or monster is at risk of harm.
The violet fungus cited as an example would not make a saving throw. It is not resisting the fear spell, it is just incapable of being affected by it.
It is not "at risk of harm" from the fear spell, so it is not forced to make a save.
Similarly, a creature without vision would not save against being blinded, a creature incapable of being hurt by fire would not save against fire damage.
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
No
The violet fungus would not make a saving throw.
In the PHB under Saving Throw it says:
A saving throw — also called a save — represents an attempt to resist a spell, a trap, a poison, a disease, or a similar threat. You don’t normally decide to make a saving throw; you are forced to make one because your character or monster is at risk of harm.
The violet fungus cited as an example would not make a saving throw. It is not resisting the fear spell, it is just incapable of being affected by it.
It is not "at risk of harm" from the fear spell, so it is not forced to make a save.
Similarly, a creature without vision would not save against being blinded, a creature incapable of being hurt by fire would not save against fire damage.
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
$endgroup$
No
The violet fungus would not make a saving throw.
In the PHB under Saving Throw it says:
A saving throw — also called a save — represents an attempt to resist a spell, a trap, a poison, a disease, or a similar threat. You don’t normally decide to make a saving throw; you are forced to make one because your character or monster is at risk of harm.
The violet fungus cited as an example would not make a saving throw. It is not resisting the fear spell, it is just incapable of being affected by it.
It is not "at risk of harm" from the fear spell, so it is not forced to make a save.
Similarly, a creature without vision would not save against being blinded, a creature incapable of being hurt by fire would not save against fire damage.
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
answered 24 mins ago
JackJack
10.5k44198
10.5k44198
add a comment |
add a comment |
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